I'm sure many dates are already finalized by the band, and I will celebrate every 2013 tour date announcement, but just to throw it out there:

Can we give New York a rest for 1 year?

Seriously.

NY got 5 consecutive dates to close out 2012 Summer Leg 1 AND got the NYE run...again...for the 3rd consecutive year.

And that's being generous with the numbers, because Bader Field is a fart across the state border.

From a travel and family perspective, I'm sure it's more easy for the band to stay within the northeast (and the crowd turnout will be dependable), but try giving New York a break for one year.

If you don't live in that state - let alone the region - it's beyond annoying.

And don't get me wrong, I'll be the first person to give a nod to traditional venues and spots for this band. The history is rich.

But mix it up.

Like, is the idea of a festival in New Hampshire, Oregon, or New Mexico (etc) that much of a reach?

There's no lack of rural territory in this country either.

Just change the NYE gag to a random clue of how many times they'll play New York the follwing year.

1 louder.

Northeast is where a majority of the fan base is. Makes sense that it gets the most dates.

They may play most of their shows in the Northeast, but an overwhelming percentage are in New York. Why? Jones Beach, Darien, SPAC, CMAC, Bethel, MSG and I'm probably missing some...and now Watkins looming as a fest lead? It's a little much...

i would be down to the f***ing town for a festival at Bader Field, what a venue, good vibes, beautiful view.

edit: just remembered how clean and refreshing that ocean air is there.

@lacesoutmike said:

Northeast is where a majority of the fan base is. Makes sense that it gets the most dates.

Backwards thinking. The fan base would grow if they played more dates outside the NE.

@Euclid said:

Meh, kind of hard to apply that to Phish.

respectfully disagree brah. more people that get to see them live = more phans. hard to dispute that.

Im willing to go to anywhere from Texas. Not that big of a deal.

I live 10 minutes from the Watkins racetrack so Im a little biased when it comes to festival location preference

@Euclid said:

Im willing to go to anywhere from Texas. Not that big of a deal.

Or, you have to?

I'm in Oregon and yes we have to travel, also not a big deal. That said, a Festy (or jeez, even a show or two) in Oregon wouldn't suck. I can think of a few places. I'm not opposed to Watkin's Glen, but it's a bit more challenging to get there.

@WickerAndCork said:

Backwards thinking. The fan base would grow if they played more dates outside the NE.

Burgettstown, Blossom, Riverbend, Deer Creek, Alpine, Charlotte, St. Louis, and OKC all well below capacity this year says no.

12 shows (AC, JB, SPAC, MSG) account for 1/3 of the shows played this year yet close to 45% of ticket sales. They would be dumb to not bank off the larger fanbase that NY is central to.

The numbers if you don't believe

I mean, it is what it is. I'm willing to do anything to see as much of this band as possible. I got to the show late, I have to make up what I can while these guys are still tearing it up. So locations and travel never enter my mind as a negativity, I see the location as the place to be. I can make it there or I can't. If they played a few shows in texas, I would be excited. When shows are in hard to reach places I have never been, then I get even more excited.

I don't have to do anything, I will travel to see this band, it's not a bad thing to me.

@WickerAndCork said:

Plus, isn't the very idea of a festival to make it easy as possible for the most people to attend?

Now you're making the argument for the northeast.

@GrooveHolmes said:

@WickerAndCork said:

Backwards thinking. The fan base would grow if they played more dates outside the NE.

Burgettstown, Blossom, Riverbend, Deer Creek, Alpine, Charlotte, St. Louis, and OKC all well below capacity this year says no.

12 shows (AC, JB, SPAC, MSG) account for 1/3 of the shows played this year yet close to 45% of ticket sales. They would be dumb to not bank off the larger fanbase that NY is central to.

The numbers if you don't believe

Are those numbers available for 2011, '10 & '09? Be interesting to see trends... That is a hard fact to take, though. More, smaller venues, perhaps? Bill Graham was a damn hard ticket to get.

If they aren't playing in California or the Northeast, they only fill half of the venues capacity. CA and Northeast sell out every time. I think it will be at Watkins again because they can almost guarantee 60k and have the potential/capacity for 100k plus considering its the 30th anniversary, who knows how phans will react to that. They probably broke even in Indio and only drew 48k at SBIX. If they are going to pack the house, it's got to be in the Northeast.

What if Phish sold three day passes for $100, that would bring the wooks from all over the country.

@cjfphan21 said:

If I'm not mistaken, wasn't SBIX "below capacity"?

Oh yeah, extremely. Watkins can do 140k or something. Only 48k for SBIX, way below capacity.

@WickerAndCork said:

Wait a tic,

SPAC, Centrum, Burgettstown, Riverbend and Blossom are all pretty close to this supposed "fan base", right? (None of these sold out)

While sellouts were in VA, Jones Beach, L.A. & SFO, KC, AL & GA...

Just where the heck is this "fan base", anyway?

SPAC holds 25,000 and averaged 20+ a night making it the largest average crowd at any venue. Burgettstown, Riverbend, and Blossom are not so close, a good 7-11 hour drive from here. We get enough shows close to us that there is no need to travel that far. I have not had to take a day off or drive more than 3 1/2 hours to see a 3.0 show. (sorry)

@Euclid said:

@cjfphan21 said:

If I'm not mistaken, wasn't SBIX "below capacity"?

Oh yeah, extremely. Watkins can do 140k or something. Only 48k for SBIX, way below capacity.

I thought it was less than that. I remember reading somewhere betweeen 35-40k.

Seriously. The fact that we're even talking about a Phish Festival means that we are winning!

I may grumble, but I'll probably bite down and travel to wherever it is. Drove to Indio - that was like 20hrs of driving each way.

@WickerAndCork said:

Seriously. The fact that we're even talking about a Phish Festival means that we are winning!

I may grumble, but I'll probably bite down and travel to wherever it is. Drove to Indio - that was like 20hrs of driving each way.

This is true. I used to be well versed in the long drive. Fall '95 I racked up 20,000 mile from mid September through New Years chasing them around the country.

new york,,, its just better than your state.. hahaha plus we got jeter.... 5 rings...............we got 3 of the 9 festivals all at different venues....gonygonygo

Upstate New York is pretty large. Watkins is somewhat central and the venue itself proved to be a piece of cake. It's drivable from areas out to Chicago. DC. Boston. NYC. Buffalo... Much better than limestone... Place isn't central to anywhere except northern Maine.

It makes sense

@GrooveHolmes said:

I'm also still not convinced that there is any truth to Watkins Glen. It may still be somewhere new this year.

i completely agree

I just moved to NY and saw my first 9 3.0 shows this year, I am good with NY shows, keep em coming.

@GrooveHolmes said:

@WickerAndCork said:

Backwards thinking. The fan base would grow if they played more dates outside the NE.

Burgettstown, Blossom, Riverbend, Deer Creek, Alpine, Charlotte, St. Louis, and OKC all well below capacity this year says no.

12 shows (AC, JB, SPAC, MSG) account for 1/3 of the shows played this year yet close to 45% of ticket sales. They would be dumb to not bank off the larger fanbase that NY is central to.

The numbers if you don't believe

I think pegging shows in major areas is more key than just looking at last tours stats. Just look at Blossom, DC, and Alpine.

Put a show in Chicago and you would eclipse the AV numbers by a long shot. Same with the others, put them more near city centers and numbers would boost. Mix it up, which sounds like it might be the case this summer.

Put some smaller venues with multiple shows and some larger venues after. They can help create that ticket supply and demand. If people get shutout and a show provides (UIC 11) people will build it up and more will come out to play.

Also, venture around the country some more...west of the Mississippi (besides CO and CA)

@themefromthepossum said:

@GrooveHolmes said:

I'm also still not convinced that there is any truth to Watkins Glen. It may still be somewhere new this year.

i completely agree

I have no reason NOT to agree with this. And I'm ok with that. I understand that Watkins was fantastic, but there's always something to be said for "new adventures." Wasn't at least part of the thrill of WG the fact that it was new, and getting to explore all the unfamiliar grounds and see how it all shakes out?

I hope they do it in VT.

/just kind of typing out loud here...